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Good Conversation

Few disagreements continue on the basis of 100% error. From the beginning, our spiritual enemy told a half truth (Gen 3:5) and ever since we have been unintentionally, falling into his example.

Sometimes the art of telling half-truths is intentional. But more often it reflects the limitations of one point of view.

Monologues tend to reflect one perspective. Good conversation tends to draw out different ways of looking at the truth.

We’ve often seen two sides (or more) surface in this blog . Recent conversations have revolved around a God who is both one and three; a spiritual life that involves work to rest; and, around the last post, recognition of the written and living word of God… which involves seeing the written word with our physical eyes, and the living Word with the eyes of our heart (2Cor 4:18; Rom 1:20). (written and living must correspond)

So often the truth God has called us to is not an either-or, but rather a both-and. Yet having said that, we need to know when both-and truths require us to make either-or decisions.

For example, we are called to fear God, and to love him. Best case is to see that there is a time for both. Worst case is to think God is only to be feared, only to be loved… or to proudly focus on his love when fear is called for, or to retreat in fear when God is seeking to embrace us in love.

Good conversation helps us to sort all of this out.

Since we are all in process… it’s good to have a safe-place, among friends, where we can test our thinking to see what sticks– what doesn’t– what multiplies… and what divides…

Your turn :-)…

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52 Responses to “Good Conversation”

  1. bubbles143jc says:

    You, this Ministry has been so faithful to His Word, I thank God for you and pray for His continued blessings for you.

    Your insight, your generousity has filled me with an overflowing joy. This “Been Thinking About”, is wonderful and I will have to be chewing on it a lot – GOOD!

    God bless.

  2. GeeTee says:

    I haven’t given much thought to the blog for today yet, but as I was trying to log-in to WtR it wouldn’t quite do it so I’ll post thats’ on this. Have spent some time this morning thinkin’ about and re-reading about ‘Working to Rest’ and just exactly how does that apply to me right here right now. When the Israelites were led out of Egypt, and even their last days in Egypt, they were first-hand spectators of God’s power and glory. God provided everything that was necessary for the trip to Canaan. When the spies brought back the report the people were afraid to conquer even though they were assured God would go before them. Back to Sinai, into the wilderness, roaming around for the time it took for all but Joshua and Caleb to die off. And even then, no rest. When I was born again I was assured that God would see me through. Did I believe this? By all means. Did I let it work in my life? Hardly. Not having been mixed with true faith I was afraid to go in. Longing for “my Egypt”, I let myself be led by lust, pride, and rebellion into the wilderness. Until all those things that held me in bondage to the Egypt of my past were allowed to die off I wandered. God supplied provision for me in my rebellious state, but I was refused entrance into the Promised Land. When my Jordan was finally crossed the battles began. I put my trust in the Lord Jesus to help me find rest and He did. We’ve fought those battles together. He is victorious, and His Word assures me that I can be victorious with Him. But if I’m tempted to sin in whatever way it might be, am I to say “There’s my temptation Lord, You go deal with it.” It’s mine and it has to be confronted by me. I can stand strong in my faith and trust in God’s Word and promises. Or I can crumble and give in. If I truly am resting in Jesus and His finished work the Spirit of Christ enables me to enter in and conquer the foe. Thank you Lord Jesus for calling me friend. I agree with you DMG and I think it’s sjd on how you can’t “separate” like what was somewhat implied in BTA. For me, there is no ‘word behind the word’. However, I understand that to an unregenerate soul it’s just ink on paper. And it’s real easy to fall for distorted teaching if one doesn’t know the Word. I congregated with a WofF fellowship years ago that would “wherever 2or3 are in agreement they can ask…” and then hold God to these unreasonable expectations of what He had to do because they agreed upon it. To me, that’s seeing behind the word. And it’s dangerous. For we are not ignorant of his devices. Gotta go. Bye. GT

  3. cherielyn says:

    Got my laptop back on Friday & have been trying to catch up on the blogs & posts I missed while it was gone.

    rokdud5, Laurielee, sjd & the rest of this wonderful ‘family’:

    I just submitted a post on the BTW “Working to Rest” blog addressing some of your comments.

    I haven’t yet digested this one enough to comment. Later.


  4. kaliko88 says:

    True, Mart, all of it, especially since the process is lifelong. But, there are times when the only safe place is in quiet, private prayer.

  5. SFDBWV says:

    “Good Conversation” Mart, this blog has been to me a real honest godsend. I have always been a social person, and have sought out every opportunity to engage in the enjoyment of a good conversation.

    My most obvious advantageous place to do so was at work. But since the circumstances of my life have placed me here, my ability to share in and be involved in conversations have been greatly diminished.

    There is no church anywhere that I have seen or heard of where one can participate in an ongoing conversation 24 hours a day 7 days a week….Except here, in RBC’s Been Thinking About. All due to the efforts of Mart DeHaan.

    I find it an honor and privilege that Mart allows me to be a participant. That I must conduct myself in a mannerly fashion and remember I am in someone elses home and conduct myself accordingly. I must show grace and character and be curtious to everyone. This is the least I can do to show Mart my appreciation for his efforts.

    I will do my part and share what I have learned in life and listen to the efforts of others and their ideas. And in the privacy of my heart I will make choice of what is good and what is not.

  6. daisymarygoldr says:

    Agree about we are all in process and good conversation allows us to test our thinking. I don’t know about “to see what sticks– what doesn’t– what multiplies… and what divides…”

    It is true, Good conversation… tends to draw out different ways of looking at the truth.

    The books of the Bible were written in different languages by different men living in different places and in different eras, yet there is no contradiction. There is one common theme that runs through all of it, from Genesis to Revelation… they all unite to glorify God and condemn everything that is not of God.

    Good conversations should help us converge in God’s word and conform to the mind of Christ. We test our thinking to see if it is inspired by human wisdom or God’s wisdom. We test to see if our thinking aligns with God’s truth even if His truth appears as too ideal or impractical. We test to see whether our thinking justifies our ways or if it justifies God’s way. We test to see if our thinking serves to satisfy what we desire or what God desires. We test to see if our thinking edifies the Church or if it accuses the Church.

    BTW, if our thinking is from the world… it will be readily heard (listened to) easily understood and accepted. However, if our thinking is from above i.e. from God… it will be least hip… extremely unpopular and no one will listen to it. That itself should tell us if our thoughts reflect falsehood or the truth. Just some loud thinking in a safe place…

  7. laney says:

    !Timothy Let no man despise your youth but be thou an example of the believers,in word, in conversation,in charity, in spirit,in faith, in purity.
    1 peter 1:15 But as He which has called you is Holy be ye Holy in all manner of conversation.16 Because it is writtenBe ye Holy;for I’am Holy.17and if you call on the Father Who without respect of persons judges according to every man’s work,pass the time of your sojourning here in fear.I need the Lord’s help every day in regards to my conversation.If I’am angry and do not control that anger my conversation can come out being a curse to someone instead of a blessing.I also need to remember the world is watching me so I need to set a good example

  8. laney says:

    I don’t know what happened I couldn’t add any more on there.I need to set a good example for my neighbors to see.Unfortnately I don’t always walk in the spirit so I sometimes fail at pleasing my Lord.I need to remember he is going to hold me accountable for my speech.I need to use it to help build up and edify others.The most important conversations I can Have are with my Lord.During the day If I get busy and take my eyes off the Lord and stop conversing with him I feel a deep sense of loss.Whenyou spend time in the presence of the Lord in conversation and then you neglect him for any lenght of time you feel that loss.At least I do.I need to be in his presence and in conversation with him continually.

  9. plumbape says:

    The truth of sciptures to me is like a huge mural that a friend sent me to check out from Canada. Seen at mural mosaic. and then the usual com. All differant artists made each tile to fit together to make one large picture of a man and a horse. But you can click on each tile to enlarge it and it is incredible how that artist could use that picture to fit into that big picture. Now imagine taking out several tiles (truths) and it loses the meaning in the big picture and individually.

    Rick123> Brother I think you are a man after God’s heart for sure but in my opinion you are still trying to drag earthly thinking into the Kingdom of God. Jesus did not grow up learning from the old testament about who His Father is. Jesus was with God the Father before the earth was created! Jesus didn’t come to earth to learn something, when He was a young Man He was teaching to the elders, He is the moral code of conduct. Like your earlier posts about the Son of mary but Jesus called Himself Son of man, our Savior. You quote Gen.3:5 and skip the entire OT to John 8:44 which is where Jesus is talking to the Jewish keepers of the law being the sons of satan but leaving out the first part of the paragraph with no explanation makes it seem you are talking about the people who are reading this. Praying you are able to see Gods big picture and let the Spirit of the Lord guide you. Maybe I’m wrong you seem to know the scripture well. I mean no disrespect.

  10. laney says:

    Mart, I agree with what SfDBWV said.There are not enough words of gratitude for all your hard work to provide this extra special place for you brothers and sisters in Christ to fellowship and teach and learn from one another the word of God.The Lord has used you to Bless the Body of Christ here on this site.And I pray that the Lord Bless you mightly for all that you provide for us here.You are greatly appreciated.

  11. GeeTee says:

    Romans3:19-31…Romans5:1-5…Romans5:18-21…Romans7:21-8:11…Romans9:30-10:1-4…Galatians2:17-21, all have something to say about it. I agree, plumbape. We can do nothing. Jesus did it all. GT

  12. Mart De Haan says:

    Seems to me that good conversation needs to be free to flow and even to go down side roads. But am going to start limiting comments repeatedly pressing an agenda regardless of the subject being discussed. Please be patient with me if I start deleting comments that seem too far out of bounds :-)…

    Also, let’s make sure that we put enough paragraph spaces between thoughts so that our comments are easier to read.

  13. gr8grannyjacobs says:

    Seems to me good conversation regarding God’s word should always build up and encourage. Love and caring for one another without trying to force our own opinions on anyone. God alone for me will give understanding to a truly open and seeking heart. Just a thought

    Mart Thank you so much for all you do and especially the spacing:)

  14. pegramsdell says:

    Mart, I totally agree with your statement

    “Monologues tend to reflect one perspective. Good conversation tends to draw out different ways of looking at the truth.”

    Some of the best conversations I have ever had, have been when we are drawing out different ways of looking at the truth. And examining the scriptures. I love it.

    Also, about fear and love at the same time, I know my children love me and “fear” me (don’t want to hurt me or have me dissappointed in them).

    Thanks Mart for good subjects and conversation. :)

  15. Called2Serve says:

    Hello! Hope everyone is having a nice day. Beautiful weather over here in Ohio! God sure has blessed us! =]

    About the “both-and” part:
    I think a lot of us tend to look at the right here and now and not try to see the big picture. I know that I tend to do that a lot. I want what is better right now; who cares what it does in the long-run. We focus on what seems better right now, only seeing half of the picture. We do what is easier, less-stressful, or what goes along with our plan for our life. We choose to only fear God when it’s easiest, or we choose to only love God when it’s easiest. Because it’s hard to maintain the “both-and” relationship with God. It requires work and effort on our part, and we have so much to do already, we can’t afford to “waste” the time sitting idly talking with God. So we do what is easier. The “either-or” relationship. Our relationship with God becomes dependant on what situation we are in at the time and what is EASIEST for us to do. Do the harder thing for once.

    Just my thoughts for today. =]

    Have a great day!!


  16. chalice says:

    When I think of “good conversation” I am reminded of Colossians 4:6 which says, in part, “Let your conversation be always full of grace, seasoned with salt….” The writer of Colossians was referring to conversation with nonbelievers, but the injunction works equally well with any “good conversation”.

  17. OGramps says:

    Good morning Mart and All,

    “Either or/Both and” It took me awhile to get my head around this one… Monday morning I guess. But, as I was thinking about this the idea of scritural paradox came to mind. Such as, to be exalted you must humble yourself, to be an effective leader you must have a servants heart, and so forth. So to fear God (i.e. respect Him) and to love him, I think are two sides of the same coin. How can one truely love someone and yet have no respect for them? Or how can you respect and not have a measure of love?

    I have observed that those who don’t know Christ have a warped idea of what that word fear means, and as a result are constantly tripping over concept. In reality it is natural that one follows the other.

    I have read a ton of scripture passages that carry this concept of paradox. Check it out it is really cool how God does this through the hand of man and yet man for the most part doesn’t recognize it, and yet all scripture fits together, just like the picture plumbape was talking about. Only the big picture is Jesus!

    Blessings on all,

  18. Laurielee says:

    I learned something interesting in my Comp class… most discussions break down over “definitions”…the definition we give to a concept.

    I think that this is also true in G-d’s Word. It’s the “connotation”, or personal definition we have with a word or concept. To give an example, the word “fear”.
    I think a person who has faced abuse and one who hasn’t would look at the word differently. A person who is a believer and one who isn’t would also define it differently…then bring the last two preconditions into the mix and you now have MANY different definitions of the same word.

    I think that the word “Love”, has a marked difference between a believer and an unbeliever.

    I agree that there are many who emphasize only one characteristic of G-d, to the exclusion of all others.

  19. SFDBWV says:

    Just as in any society of peoples, there are thoes who spoil things for everyone else. So laws are made to protect the masses from the few who abuse freedom.

    The blog has not escaped drawing in this part of society.So we have grown up.

    Law’s (restrictions) will be tested. The keepers of the law now must move away from being equal to being in authority. More proof that sin (bad behavior)is a destructive force and has it’s unpleasent effect on all.

    I am looking forward to the next topic so we can see how the “new” look of the blog will effect it’s presentation.

    48 degrees, raining, some small stream flooding. We are fine here in the mountains of West Virginia.


  20. sawaybon says:

    Good morning, everyone! Gorgeous day up here in Canada as well. Glad to be back in circulation again. Thanks to all for the prayers regarding my surgery 10 days ago. I am in recovery mode. It appears that a subsequent surgery will be necessary, and now it is an issue of timing. My planned departure for Malaysia in mid-July is not simply a trip — it is relocation for overseas ministry (2 years minimum), so I would really appreciate your continued prayers that this medical situation would be resolved by that time. Thanks.

    I really like this topic in today’s blog. I have come to appreciate the need for increased ‘both/and’ thinking and conversation. I have had too much of an ‘either/or’ attitude for most of my life, and my perspective is changing. I am currently reading a book in preparation for a course on Cross-Cultural Communication, and the author, Sherwood Lingenfelter, stresses the need to recognize the tension of basic values in different cultures. Some are very time-oriented, whereas others are event-oriented. Some people are task-oriented, whereas others are person-oriented. Some use dichotomistic (either/or)thinking, whereas others use holistic (both/and) thinking.

    Lingenfelter proposes the incarnation as God’s metaphor for ministry. He describes Jesus as the 200-percent Person (100% human and 100% divine), and we know that God Himself became flesh and dwelt among humans. What are the implications of this incarnation? Does His example have any significance for us as we are sent to others to have ‘good conversation’ with them?

    Contrary to plumbape’s comment that Jesus didn’t learn (had no need to), Lingenfelter suggests that Jesus was a learner. He was not born with a knowledge of language or culture. In this respect, He was an ordinary child who learned language from his parents. He learned how to play from his peers. He learned the trade of a carpenter from Joseph. The implications of Jesus’ status as a learner are seldom discussed, let alone understood or applied. God’s Son studied the language, the culture, and the lifestyles of His people for thirty years before He began His ministry. He was 100 percent God and 100 percent Jew — a 200-percent Person.

  21. OGramps says:


    That is an interesting idea and i can agree with most of it but what bothers me is the teaching at the temple. How would Jesus as a young lad at the temple be able to teach the people and still have had time the “learn” the scriptures first? The math doesn’t work for me.


  22. mtman says:

    I don’t know how many ever go back and read the comment guidelines but here is a portion:
    Please stay on topic. The purpose of this blog is to encourage discussion and community. The following will not be posted:
    Simple kudos for blog authors or content.
    Any comments not related to the blog topic. If you have something that you would like to comment on that is not related to the material in the blog, please contact us.
    Please be courteous in your comments, especially if you disagree with the blog author or other commentators.
    The following will not be posted:
    Obscene, threatening, abusive, hateful, racist or sexually explicit language.
    Personal attacks on the blog author or anyone else. Any negative reference to other people or organizations.
    Political statements.
    Advertisements or solicitations.
    Links to other websites.
    Your own or someone else’s personal information, such as e-mail addresses, mailing addresses, phone numbers, etc.
    I don’t get the impression that Mart intends to censor any comments that do not fall in the above realm. My opinion is that we (all of us – some worse than others) have strayed from the guidelines. Staying within the guide should not mean that one person can ruin it for the rest of us. I totally disagree with that concept. Some have really abused the privilege of posting here and who’s to blame for that? If contrary thoughts and opinions threaten you to the point where some should be excluded I don’t think that presents a very good Christian example either. Had we in my opinion followed the guidelines all along we wouldn’t need new direction.
    I don’t think if we disagree with another person we need to run to Mart to stop what they are saying. We either ignore their comment or address them directly. When it gets out of hand Mart can take appropriate measure.
    Conversation is a two way street. We all come from different places in our walk with the Lord. We have different backgrounds, different demoninational persuasions, and our common thread should be our love for the Lord and our loving blog community here. If we can’t carry on a conversation without subtle attacks on each other maybe we need to read the posting guidelines EACH time before we post. Because someone doesn’t come from where we think they should be at doesn’t mean they should be shunned or abused. Personally I’m glad that we are being reminded to stay on topic.

  23. Helmet says:

    This time, my english was sleeping, I couldn’ get it completely. But, I already read one in spanish from Mart in rbclatino, about Agur words (prov 30) and I feel refers same problem. How we take the Word, how we tell others about, with our mouth, with our testimony.
    Last week we joined in family, three days after a relative came to our home, said this and that person said this and that about you, daid your daughter did this… A storm started when she left, because there were lies in almust (or all) words, “oh no, this and that person are wrong, they are to watch about their owns…”
    At least, when storm got calm, I said: I think, like in other times, those words are lie, and I fell talking about relatives when maybe they did not say a word of this. Could be they said, ¿did you ask who was? and words turned “He said your daughter did it”.
    All covered will be uncovered, all our words will be against us when we change meaning of God. We don’t love God if we change His Words, and so we would not be able to love each other this way, because God is love.
    All law is acomplished in love your neighbour as you do your self, isn’t it?
    Do I am in topic, or I’m lost? Maybe my brain does not work today, flue in México makes us to be still at home, and my brain took vacations I guess.
    Kiss 4 all.

  24. Helmet says:

    I just remember about a friend who left faith because of bad testimony of some. By now, he says that God speaks to him (to go back to idols), I wonder how, since he doesn’t read the Bible daily. Those who are near God can hear His voice, Holly Ghost lead when we mean to be leaded by God, those are wholoves His Word, who keep His testimonies, in memory and in the heart as life experiences. Since I believe, I talk.
    My prayer is for him, about since he is not under God’s wings, he can’t have peace, actually he feels lonely. May God keep all of us in His path, to be truth, to have peace and joy and other can see God’s hand in our life, and come to Him.
    Bless u all.


  25. poohpity says:

    Hi Jimmy oh I mean Mart,

    Knowing the whole truth and nothing but the truth will set you free. It is so easy for the truths in God’s word to be twisted. I think that is why it is so important to know God and His word so we aren’t lead down a primrose path. The truths in God’s word are the same for all it is the same message for everyone. The Word is the only thing that no matter where we come from or what we have been through it is the same for all. God is our common factor but it takes all of us to make a whole as in the church.

    I do fear God because His power is beyond anything I can imagine and then He called me friend. Wow!! Good conversation leaves me with thoughts to ponder and new things to learn, I do not believe it leaves me with a horrible taste in my mouth that I want to spit out. I believe that good conversation prompts me to discover how to apply scripture to everyday life and to live it out daily.

    I bel

  26. chalice says:

    “Monologues tend to reflect one perspective. Good conversation tends to draw out different ways of looking at the truth.”

    Perhaps nowhere does this statement ring truer than with reference to a conversation between a believer and an atheist. Too often the conversation really is an exchange of “monologues” with neither participant really listening to the other. I’ve participated in more than a few of these exchanged-monologues myself from time to time.

    On the other hand, I have also engaged in meaningful conversations with atheists where different ways of looking at the truth are drawn out of the discussion. Perhaps the result is merely to understand another’s point of view, however irreconcilable that view may be to my faith-based, Biblical understanding of God. Sometimes, faith is strengthened when weaknesses are perceived in the “other side” of the discussion. Occasionally, although infrequently, I’ve witnessed atheists who admit that they want to re-think some of the ideas they’ve believed in light of the “good conversation” that draws out different ways of looking at the truth. It helps, of course, when you know the revealed truth. It also helps to share that “good conversation” in the spirit of love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, generosity, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control.

  27. GeeTee says:

    Sorry to have disturbed/disrupted(?) the koffee klatch. Y’all have a pleasant from now on.

  28. pegramsdell says:

    DMG, I’m in prayer agreement with you that your daughter is alright and does not have a virus, Thank You Jesus!

    Knowing….the truth will set you free….and the truth is…that the prayers of the righteous avails much. So…I am believing your daughter is healed.

  29. rokdude5 says:

    To me having “good free flowing conversation” is one thing but for me to say I know the complete absolute truth of God is another. God will always be bigger than my knowledge of Him will ever be for if I attained complete and thorough knowledge of Him then I become Him (which is something I dont want to do.)

    The dichotomy I am dealing with is trying to understand God yet not to the level where my knowledge of Him equals His (though it is God who chooses to reveal Himself to us.) To me its akin to trying to understand my wife. As much as I want to understand her, there are certain things where “I just dont get it”. (At least, God gave us a book in trying to understand Him.)

    We all bring our perspectives to the table when we engage in conversations about God which is all well and good as long as we look to His Book to see if our own perspective is correct.

    Of course to me there are tons of gray areas in the Bible. For example, what was Jesus talking about when He said “…on this rock, I will build my church.”? Matt 16:18. Was He talking about Himself or the granite under His feet or Peter? I dont think we will ever truly know on this side of the Pearly Gates.

    So what do we do with these “gray areas”? In my heart, it would be foolish of me to “blast” someone out of the water because their interpretation is different. To me, if your interpretation is honoring God and yet loving to one another as God wants us to be then I would praise God and check myself to see if I need correction!

  30. Laurielee says:

    It is possible that we have wandered into “what divides”…
    Sometimes we tend (I know I do) to give generalities in order to not hurt feelings; the only problem with that is that people are still trying to figure out what, exactly, is meant or who it is directed towards. There ARE the gray areas in G-d’s Word. Could it be that the gray areas are then not that important? If He’d have meant for us to get a certain point, wouldn’t He have made it clearer? Such as the “rock” example above.

    Are we making things clearer when we talk to others, or futher confusing them?

    I am possibly taking some above comments too literally, but I am now fearful of telling someone like Sawaybon that I am praying for them, or to tell someone that their post did indeed make things clearer.

    GeeTee, I, for one, like reading your posts. You seem real.

  31. poohpity says:

    When does the Christian walk become only “Good Conversation”? Is that all it is to believers of this day and age? There are so many things that can be found to divide and the things or the principles that can be found that weave their way through those pages to benefit mankind we overlook and desire strife instead. So when does the conversation stop and the work begin. Do we really understand what God desires from us or is it always going to be lip service.

  32. bubbles says:

    I’m just plain bubbles, not the bubbles143jc.  I am sorry if I used someone else’s username.  I wasn’t trying to copycat.

    re: ‘fearing God’ vs. ‘loving God’:  When I try to get my finite, human mind around who Almighty God, the Great I AM ,truly is, it does strike fear in my heart. Thinking about how He holds my next heartbeat/breath in His hand is a frightening thought.

    But then, on the other hand, He sent His only Son to die for sinful people because He loved us so much. There are people tohere on earth that I love and respect. I try be careful to please them, and not disappoint them because I respect them so much. Then, I will turn around and sin thoughtlessly–a unkind thought or word. . . those sins disappoint and hurt the Lord.

    I look forward to spending eternity thanking my Father for His great love and mercy.

  33. gr8grannyjacobs says:

    GeeTee Why are you going? We often disagree among ourselves but there is a bond that keeps us all connected. ( Our Father ) Like Laurielee I enjoyed your post’s but would like them spaced for easier reading.If we can’t get along here and have conversation together how shall we ever live in heaven? I am amazed that we get angry with one another and haven’t even met each other. I hope we are all praying for each other to work through this whatever…….? GeeTee as for me I will miss your comment’s.

    Laurielee Please don’t be afraid to post as your word’s are always kind and God’s love shine’s through them.

    daisy Take me off the pedestal:) You are unique and very special.

  34. Laurielee says:

    Lovely to hear from you, Gr8granny…

  35. laney says:

    GeeTEE, This Koffee Klatch will not have a pleasant one.Not when an a part of the body of Christ is missing.
    There is only one GeeTee.No one on this site can replace you.You will be sorely missed.
    I just read what you wrote on yesterdays site. Your words are so true.

  36. sjd says:

    Trying to understand a person’s view rather than always assuming I know what they are thinking, and moving on to a response, is something I continually must fight. Clarifying questions, or restatements of what I think the other person is saying shows that I might be processing correctly what is being said.

    The other day I was sharing Christ with a man named Jim. He had no fear of death, he said. He should, because he doesn’t know the Lord, and his physical death is near. Mart’s statement above reminded me that this is one of the times where someone must not focus only on God’s love. He first must understand he needs to fear God, to fear Judgment. Without that understanding he can not understand God’s love.

    In asking Jim if he understood his condition, he responded that he still had two hands. We had just been talking about the reality of Hell, and how Jesus said that it would be better to enter Heaven with one hand than Hell with two hands. Seemed to me he was starting to get the picture. Then when talking about Jesus death, he responded, “I couldn’t do that for someone.” Seemed like we had a good conversation, but am still waiting for him to trust in Jesus.

    I mentioned this at the end of one day’s post a couple days ago, but will mention it again, please pray that Jim would soon be a brother of ours in Christ. . Thank you Daisy for praying. I am looking forward to a “good conversation” with Jim soon. No, hopefully a great conversation.

    I look forward to more good conversations here as well, including with GeeTee.

    cheryl, I finally responded to your post.

  37. Rick123 says:

    If men go against the truth, then the children will cry out in the streets. “This is not thus saith the LORD”

    Isa 59:14 Justice is turned back, and righteousness stands afar off; for truth has stumbled in the public squares, and uprightness cannot enter.

  38. Loretta Beavis says:

    I like this blog very much. It’s positive, I think, to keep getting “stirred up” about what God would have us to gain from His Word.

    I’ve only posted a few times, but when I finish, I go back and “edit” out a lot
    because I know I get emotional and stray from the point.

    Most of my life has been a great loss because I lived in either-or, which today I
    think would be called ‘religion’ that is, man-made rules on how I am to relate to
    God…seems thats where our spiritual enemy gains ground. I feared God. I didn’t
    read the Bible…I just went to church now and then. I believed you only get God’s love by being good. Looking back, I lived a life of unintentional half truth, trying to please everyone.

    I finally began to experience the both-and-truths when I spiritually realized I’m now a child
    of God,
    through faith in Jesus (Gal. 3:26 NKJ)

    My Dad used to get mad at me and I was respectfully afraid of him. But I experienced love from him too. Religion kept me in the dark thinking I was in a contract relationship with God, not a personal or family relationship with Him.

    I know now my heavenly Father loves me and gets mad at me because I belong to Him, He wants only good for me and He is forgiving.

    So it seems this blog is a spiritually healthy place to getmy perspectives sharpened (or maybe re-angled) and if non-believers start participating,
    they may desire to join the Family!

  39. Ted M. Gossard says:

    Yes. We need true conversation, for sure. Only then can we learn from each other. I think when we do we find many misunderstandings can be cleared up. And we’ll find ourselves closer on many issues than we had thought. But also we’ll learn to try to understand positions different than our own, the perspectives from which they come.

    But all of this can happen only out of a practice of mutual respect and love.

    Good thoughts, Mart. And a good fellowship going on on this blog.

  40. Mart De Haan says:

    Sure appreciate your open hearts. Don’t want to cut this off yet. Will wait until tonight or tomorrow morning before posting again.

  41. SFDBWV says:

    Someone famous said that the pen is mightier than the sword. If we consider the tongue a two edged sword that cuts the person who speaks as well as wounding the person being spoken to, all of this makes sense.

    GT need not, in my opinion, feel as though he needs to leave our gathering. We gather as both lost and redeemed souls. All looking for answers and comfort in the lonelyness of our hearts. No one is more special than another.

    We can encourage oneanother and should. If nessesary we should correct each other if one of us strays too far from the “Truth”. Every idea is not correct nor should it be accepted just because we are being liberal in our attitude of acceptence. But we need to be adult, caring and mindfull of anothers feelings as we do attempt to correct another.

    Did Jesus ever get upset? Of course he did. Did he get angry? Yes. Did he feel disapointment? Yes. Did he feel betrayed? Yes. How then did Jesus, our example, confront his issues? He pointed them out, and moved toward correcting the matter. He showed love and wept because he knew in spite of some seeing the “Truth” presented, it would be rejected.

    How do we as a community, deal with a person who steps over the line? Do we wait for Mart to be the moderator? Do we say nothing? Do we feel it our responsibility to correct anothers behavior?

    Unattended to, some situations have the power to totaly disrupt the entire community and integrity of the blog. As was the matter that has brought us to this entire topic and subject.

    The choice becomes, just turn off the computer and leave. Or stay and try to make a difference. Sounds like the choice many make in attending church.


  42. Helmet says:

    Let me see if I finally catch the issue. Good Conversation for me, would be just that, which can edificate our growing in Christ, all of us have an opinion, and so, each one have a different growing, depending on how much time we dedicate to Bible reading, because on heart aboundance depends what mouth speaks, or in this case, our tipping. So, here some are child, some, young people, some are seniors in feith, and all of us are working together to make this Christ body walk. Only who doesn’t want to walk wouldn’t take part. Good conversation will bring Word streams, for all to drink.
    I just see here Mart’s love, because I see my pastor’s work, who’s studying every day, preparing sunday message, diferent studies for each disciples group each week (about 4 groups different levels), meeting with those in spiritual need, praying with tears (I really mean it, he’s my brother in law) for each one needs, those who don’t want to walk, those whe can’t… all his days have too much work; so, I wonder how Mart can seat before his keyboard and take a time to write for many people who’s faces he even seen ever, to share his thoughts, and make us to share owns.

    Thats why I apreciatte his love and his time here. THANK YOU MART, I RELLY MEAN IT. Hebrews 13:7

    7 Remember those who rule over you, who have spoken the word of God to you, whose faith follow, considering the outcome of their conduct.

  43. Bill says:

    Poohpity the conversation stops when we choose to act. Good ‘conversation’, whether it be in the verbal form or written (Bible, blog, email…), stimulates the Holy Spirit within us to act out in love, serving the Lord and our Christian Community (whatever the denomination) according to the ‘still small voice’ of guidance from the Lord. Service is an individuals choice, not a group or crowd action. The same Bible verse will mean different things to different people who read it but the ultimate outcome will be God being worshipped.

    There is an math like equation I once read that has helped me in my walk and service; L = C + A. Love = Choice + Action. Gods love is there for us to accept via His word and relationships with fellow believers. We must Choose to Love others, then once we have chosen, we will take action to show our love via words or deeds. The catalyst for us choosing to Love and serve God and others is ‘Good Conversation’. The Catalyst for us to show our love for God and others is the Holy Spirit in tune with His ‘still small voice’.

  44. gr8grannyjacobs says:

    Rick123 I would like to hear your own words about how you feel about God and your own voice in the conversations we have on this site. We I am pretty sure have all read the Bible and we all honor God’s word and we meet here to discuss different insights.

    In Prayer gr8granny

  45. laney says:

    Thankyou for the reminder about the conversation between Jesus and the thief on the cross.That is the only hope for man in this sin cursed world.
    It just breaks my heart that people are so blind and don’t see the need to have that conversation with Jesus.There will be many who will regret it.
    They will get to have another conversation with the Lord at the great white throne judgement.Only problem they will not like the outcome when Jesus says to them get away from me I never knew you.That is one conversation the lost are going to regret for eternity.

  46. Laurielee says:

    Is a belief unchallenged really a belief? Is our house built on a good, strong foundation or shifting sand? I’m thinking that a person could grow up around believers, therefore, they believe what those around them believe. What if someone were to walk up to this person and say, “WHY do you believe what you believe?” A teacher of mine told me that if a person does not learn to think for themselves someone else will do it for them. He said that if you are challenged in what you believe and you still hold that belief after having gone through the critical thinking process, your belief will be tested and stronger for the exercise…or you will lose lightly-held beliefs that have no foundation. I thought that was a wise teaching. Is it any wonder that I came to find out that this teacher is a Christian?

  47. Rick123 says:

    gr8grannyjacobs: God is my Father, Jesus is my Lord and Savior. And words can’t express my gratitude for for what Jesus has and will be doing for me.

    Jesus is God-Jesus is the Good Shepherd-Jesus is the Word of God made Flesh-Jesus is the Way, the Truth, and the Life-Jesus is the Resurrection-Jesus is the Lamb-Jesus is Worthy-Jesus the Power, and the Wisdom of God-Jesus is the Lion of the tribe of Juda, the Root of David -Jesus Reveals God’s Love-Jesus is my All, Jesus Paid It All.

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